Episode 11: JFK Assassination: Theories and Conclusions – Part 5

Hi everybody, this is Eric. This is Shaw. What’s up guys? This is Jorge. Welcome back to the Conspiracy Podcast. We are on the finale, jfk. Yeah. So we’re calling this the JFK Conclusions and Theories. Yeah. How, how, how, what a great, Hmm. Really great decisive name.

So here’s, here’s just a disclaimer. If you have not listened to the episodes before, then just stop what you’re doing and go back. Listen to part one, two, and three. Seriously. Like, yeah. Cuz you know, this is gonna make no sense. I’m gonna be like, these guys are idiots. 

Now we’re gonna talk about basically the, all the conspiracy theories that exist, , and what our conclusions are of the assassination of John F.

Kennedy. I believe ’em all. . So I, I’m gonna start this podcast off with, , a poll that was taken in November of 2013. That’s, that’s not, not too long ago. Not too long ago, right? None. This poll showed that 61% of Americans believed that Kennedy was killed because of a conspiracy. See, this is why you’re listening 30%.

Thought Oswald acted alone. And you know what’s cool? If you guys are listening on, uh, Spotify, you can leave us a comment, let us know which side of, uh, that, what, what percentage you left. We are curious. Yeah. And so, so that means 9% said, I don’t know. They were like, fucking no answer. Yeah. I have no idea.

Who’s John Kennedy?

The lack of history. Yeah. . , but anyways, 61% to this. I mean, at least as of 2013, believe that it’s a conspiracy shit might be higher. So majority Yeah. Might be higher. Majority. Yeah, that’s right. So we’re gonna start with, , a couple of the, the major conspiracies and then at the end of this, we’ll, we’ll get to our conclusions and, , you know, solve the murder.

Yeah. Officer. Yeah. We’re gonna solve, we’re gonna reopen the case. Yeah. We’re gonna solve this. We’ll take it to the Supreme Justice and we’ll see what happens. Yes. It’s the Air commission. So the first, , the first conspiracy that, , I always just found to be, I don’t know, hilarious or great, is the umbrella man.

Mm-hmm. . So the umbrella man, , is in a lot of the photos. Yes. The photos of everybody scrambling on the grassy Noel. Jorge, you were there. You know what the grassy Noel looks like. And I think we talked about this in the last episode too. Mm-hmm. , you know, we touched a little bit on, on the details of this guy.

Yeah, yeah. But yeah, so, so you’re there, right? So you stood on the X Yes. Yes. So on to the right of that is this grassy area and they call it the grassy Noel. I know, it’s like a hill. Yeah. So, and a lot of the photos Yeah, go ahead. Yeah, I was gonna say, and then behind him, , what’s the guy’s name again that was taking the video?

The Zapruder Zapruder. I was Zapruder. Mix up that name. Yeah. But yeah. So the, so behind him, there’s the guy taking the video. That’s right. The umbrella man’s in front of him. If you’re, if you watch that video, you’ll see, you know what Air There’s a guy. Yeah. There’s a guy. And so on our website, eventually we’ll put up a, an image of the umbrella, man.

You know what I mean? See, it’ll, you’ll have, you’ll have the info for yourself. But, so there’s this a man and he’s carrying a black umbrella. Okay. Now this is that fucking Sun Day . This is November, uh, in Dallas. You know, it was a sunny day. , there’s no reason that he should have been having a black umbrella.

Exactly right. It’s ridiculous. , he was one of the closest people to JFK when he was struck by the bullet. So he was, he was super close to him. So as Kennedy’s limousine approach, the man opened up mm-hmm. and lifted the umbrella high above his head. , then he spun or panned the umbrella from east to west as the president passed him.

That’s super scary. Signals the hell. So then he was shot, Kennedy was killed yeah. You know, uh, the man sat down on the sidewalk next to another man, had a sandwich. No. And then . And then, and then he a, after sitting there for a while, he got up and he started walking towards the Texas school book Depository.

Oh, school book Depository. So the, the, what people are confused about or, or like concerned about is how calm he was and how calm the man was next to him. And um, so they just sat there. Anyway. So the idea of this conspiracy is that the umbrella man was the signal caller for either Oswald. or whoever killed him.

I see. So he opened the umbrella and said, pop, pop, pop. That’s a shot. . Well, it’s also, it’s like, it’s so like dramatic, like the waving it east to west. I’m like, can you have thought of like a simpler, just like, open the umbrella and that’s the sign. Yeah. Like, no, I need to shake it. So, uh, I mean, in short, that’s the conspiracy of the umbrella man.

Um, there is another like, offshoot of the umbrella man, which is that he was like, he had like an umbrella gun. No, this one’s, this one’s crazy. And it’s endorsed by one of, uh, Colonel . No, that’s the craziest part. So the umbrella man, and this, this, this is a little bit farfetched of the umbrella man, which is that he used the umbrella to fire a dart to paralyze jfk.

So he hit him. So you opened the umbrella, shut up, shot at Dart and paralyzed jfk. And so that’s the part when he grabbed his neck, but he got shot in the fucking neck. Yes. Was he also a sharp shooter? The party . Seriously? He’s a sharp shooter. Jeez. I know. I’m sorry. Hit a movie Target with Dart umbrella dart gun.

So it sounds pretty crazy. I love who, who’s this colonel? Who’s like, oh, that shit’s legit. Oh, honestly, it’s Colonel, Colonel, fucking Fletcher. Dumb Fletcher. Where are you at? Yeah, Fletcher, I don’t believe you. Yeah, you’re full of shit. So, but the idea is that he shot him with a dart and then he like, but why?

He paralyzed him and then he, then the, the headshot came. Yeah. You know, you know a good way to paralyze someone. Shoot them in the fucking head. Yeah. You don’t need a dart for that. Like, come on. Okay. So later on in time, uh, there was a journalist named Penn Jones. , he was approached by somebody who was named, Louis Steven Whit.

I was just gonna say, sorry, real quick. Penn, like being a journalist. And your first name is Penn. That’s fucking, that’s like clutch. . That’s super legit. So, , this Louie Steven Whit, he said that he was the umbrella man, and he said that he, , he just wasn’t like, he doesn’t understand why there’s a conspiracy

He’s like, I just had open my umbrella. . Yeah. He’s just like, I had an umbrella and, uh, like this was in 78 and he claimed to be the umbrella man. He claimed that he actually did it because he was anti Kennedy and it was like a black umbrella and it was gonna be filmed and he didn’t like his dad, which was Joseph Kennedy in that he, , the reason why is cause he was a supporter of like a, like of, , Neville Chamberlain, which was the British Prime Minister, and it was a Nazi kind of like, it was like an old.

You know, like, I’m gonna rebel and so I’m gonna have a black umbrella. I don’t wanna liken it to Colin Kaepernick, but a very , like that’s his way of protest. Protest. That’s his way of, of protesting it. Yes. Yes. So this guy says he was the umbrella man, and that’s why he had an umbrella. Yeah, cuz that, cuz that’s the way to show them.

Yeah. . Yeah. Look at my umbrella. Fuck you Kennedy’s. Yeah. Arms dealer. So he testified and he and Whit said, I think if the Guinness Book of World Records had a category for people who were in the wrong place at the wrong time doing the wrong thing, I would be number one. Okay. First of all, no, because he wanted to be there.

I, yeah. Protest somebody was gonna kill the president. Oh. He’s like, and he’s like, watch the protest. He’s like, I’m gonna go to the most inconspicuous place ever. Mm-hmm. booked to post story . I’m gonna go there. No, it would be kind of, I, I don’t wanna liken it to Colin Kaepernick, but it would be kind of like Colin Kaepernick kneeling a black flat, but instead of kneeling, no.

And then he’s, and then the president was shot at Niner Stadium . Oh my God. And he was like, I didn’t have anything to do with this. It wasn’t me. . Yeah. Nothing to do with this. Yeah. Anyways, that’s probably what it, anyways, so this guy, guy. , this guy wit, he died about eight years ago. Hmm. So, and all of his secrets died.

So that’s the umbrella, man. I don’t buy that one. I, that one I, I. . Well, I, I kind of buy the last part of it. I think he like, you know, he definitely was, there was a reason and he, maybe it wasn’t normal or I feel like that makes more sense because it makes sense. He was protesting. If you have a direct line of sight to take a shot, like you don’t need someone to flail an umbrella to be , oh, it’s , let’s go time.

It’s , I have the shot. Take the shot. Yeah. Right. But, but did you do any research like as far as fact checking that that’s really a thing? Or n I don’t know, like what the, the, like the whole pro, like that’s how you protest, you know what I mean? I mean, kind of like you have a black independent, there’s a lot of people independent fact checkers with a proof of something.

No, there’s a lot of people who would do a black, like the black fist, right? The, at the, the Olympics. Yeah, the Olympics. , I forget his name. Um, is it Jesse? Uh, Jesse Owens. Yeah. Jesse Owens did the black fist. . Well, it wasn’t the black fist. He was just black and it was his fist. No, he wore a black glove.

Yeah. Oh, he did? You’re right. So it was a black, it was a black item. There’s also like, you see like the posters, whether it’s like, you know, it’s, it’s a black fist. All right. So that’s, that’s the umbrella, man. I don’t know. Think it’s pretty, it’s pretty dumb. I think it’s a little farfetched. Yeah, it’s pretty dumb. Yeah. But if you, it’s kind of cool to look at some of the, the images. So if you For sure. And I can see, like at the time you look at it, you’re like, this is sketch.

This is how, what’s happening here. Yeah. The guy is like randomly with a black umbrella. Sitting on the curb, you know, . Yeah. It’s like, and the chaos. It’s like 79 degrees and it’s like sunshine. You’re like, you know, some people are calm in chaos. Like he just, he’s probably like, what the fuck just happened?

Let me, he’s in shock. Yeah. Everybody’s running around. I’m just gonna like chill. Right, . I know. Yeah. That’s why that one’s dumb. We’re all in, we all agreement. We’re all agree that that one’s dumb. Uh, so the next one is, and I call it the Oliver Stone Conspiracy. Yeah. , you know, a majority of the American public or even worldwide have has seen jfk, jk.

Yeah. Right. The movie Kevin Costner. Yeah. The movie. The movie by the way, has every famous human who’s ever lived. Yeah. It’s got like 30 famous actors, and it’s crazy. So quick. You wanna tell ’em who Oliver Stone is in case they’re listening, they don’t know. Yeah. Oliver Stone is, is probably in, in history of cinema, is is one of the most famous Directors.

Directors, yeah. Of all time. Easy actually. And then he made the JFK movie, so Yeah, he did. Yeah. So in, uh, the nineties he did a movie called jfk. It’s about three hours started. Kevin Costner, , in Kevin Costner played the New Orleans District Attorney Jim Garrison and Jim Garrison, , brought forth, I guess you would call it a conspiracy to assassinate the president.

Yes. And, and so it’s a, it’s a good movie as far as. as far as it’s the JFK and it’s solid. Yeah. Like, like looking into it. But I find and you guys, you guys both saw it, so I find it to be interesting because what he does is he, he, he goes and, and finds all the things that are wrong with the situation.

Yes. Yeah. But at the end of the movie, do you actually go, I know who did it. No, no, no, no. Not at all. 100%. You’re like, not at all. And I think that was the point. I think that was the point was just to get people to think about it. Yeah. Yeah. I think that was his whole thing of doing it. It’s like, okay, think, think like, here’s what, here’s what’s wrong.

Yeah. Like, you know, come think. is it, is this narrative really what happened, right? Yeah. Right. Yeah. So, , in short, essentially the, , Jim Garrison was a, uh, district attorney for New Orleans. And, um, he, he wrote a book in 1988 called On the Trail of the Assassins, and he prosecuted, he was the only one who prosecuted somebody for the assassination of jfk.

Mm-hmm. , nobody else brought because Oswald Killed. Got killed, killed. Yeah. And nobody actually went to court saying, this is like, I’m charging you with the murder. Yeah. Right. So he did that, uh, and he prosecuted a person by the name of Clay. , right. , played by Tommy Lee Jones. Tommy Lee Jones, that’s right.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Mm-hmm. . And so it was a fully complicated like conspiracy of, you know, CIA and like Yeah. So pretty much there’s a clay, clay Shaw was like, just, he’s like a rich New Orleans guy. , and he was involved with these like, , these pro these pro communist groups. That’s right. And he had also had ties to the CIA and that he was kind of behind the, behind the scenes orchestrating and providing funds to set up this situation.

Yeah, that’s right. And I mean, we’re not gonna go over the entire movie. No. You know, you can just watch it. And then it basically, it had somebody, and he was a PI and his name was Guy Banister. Uh, and he was in New Orleans. And, , he had an employee named David Ferry. And he, they all, they say that, , he was involved with the JFK assassination, , in that he planned it.

Uh, they were, they were, they were heavy drinkers and heavy. The movie, uh, the movie portrays them as like, . Yes. They whatever, like weird sex parties and shit. Yeah. Like there was a lot going on and like smoking and Kraken.

Yeah. Crazy cocaine and man, man, prostitutes. Yes. Yeah. So a lot of different things. And then on top of it, ferry was in the New Orleans Civil air Patrol. And he was in that air patrol with Oswald. I see. And there’s a photo of Ferry and Oswald together in their teenage years together. So that’s a connection.

And, and in one of the 8,000 times that the Oswald Oswald moved between New Orleans and Texas 17. That’s right. But I find that kind of like, just because you’re in a photo, I mean, it is suspicious, but at the same time it’s kind of like this doesn’t implicate you. Like Yeah. Like everything. You’re just in a, a photo of a team.

Yeah. You’re in a photo of a team. We’re coworkers. I’m sorry. Like Exactly. So I didn’t do it. Yeah. Another Guinness record. being at the wrong place at the wrong time. Fucking knew I should joined the Air patrol. . Now what I like about that movie is it does put together, , different people that maybe we didn’t fully go into detail, you know, in the previous episodes, but like how they were all like building this, um, you know, plot of like working together and how to set it all up.

And it kind of made it seem like they set up, you know, Lee Harvey for his take the, to take the fall. It really does. It does kind of give you that vibe. Yeah. Like he was like the Pat Patsy. Yeah. And a lot of it comes from where Banister said something to , this guy named Martin, and Martin worked for Banister and they were in a bar and they, and they got into a fight and it was like a heated argument and they were like pushing each other and you wanna go, bro, , fuck I do this, take it outside.

And he said, he said, what are you going to do? Kill me like you did. Kennedy, and then Banister drew his 3 57 Magnum and whipped him. Oh man, pistol whip. Good fellas. Damn. So that’s like the formation of the conspiracy of like, oh, he must have had something to do with it. And like, oh, you know what I mean?

Like, oh yeah. You know, I mean, that’s a, that’s a pretty big implication there, especially in a heated fight. Like you say, some shit that you’re not supposed to say, yep. Happens all the time. You know, where someone’s like, you know, get in a fight with your wife and she’s like, okay, says some shit you told her in confidence 10 years ago,

So remember that, remember that, like you said, seven years, 32 days ago, I know. 20 seconds. It was, it was 2 22 and 35 seconds. The other part of this is. Oswald shared 55 44 Camp Street with Banister? So they were literally in the same building, but the the addresses were different.

Yeah. Cuz they were, they were on like, it was like the corner of two streets. Yeah. So, I don’t know. I don’t know on that point. I mean, it is coincidence or it’s just, I mean, one can say there is no such thing as coincidence. Like when it happens multiple times. Yeah. Like, obviously coincidence do happen and like, you know, there is a thing.

But when there’s like multiple coincidences within one situation Right. It does lead you to believe that like, okay. It becomes impossible. It becomes impossible for like, it becomes clues into the Yeah. Investigation. You know, it’s like, it just, you don’t just like happen. Oh ha Oh, just randomly, we have the same building and, and this home homie, he got mad at me and said I killed jfk and then he’s in this fucking pro Castro shit.

Like, it’s just, it’s just too, it’s too many like, Yeah. Random things to be random. But you know, what I don’t like is that they kind of give too much credit to banister. Hmm. Like, just, he’s like, he’s Holmes Mastermind. He’s literally like a drunk Pi. He’s a retired, he’s a Dick . Yeah. He, he’s like a Bruce Willis character from many movies.

Bruce Real is a good one. That a good, yeah. And, and I’m just like, alright. So we shared a building with him. All right. What does that mean? It’s not like he sh you know what I mean? That’s true. I just don’t like it. I understand Don’s Then we there like other guys that were also connected to both of them.

Like, so in the late seventies, the House Select Committee on assassinations investigated the relationship between Oswald to banister’s office.

The committee was unable to interview Guy Banister because he died in 64, but the committee did interview his brother Russ or Ross. Ross told the committee that his brother had mentioned seeing Oswald handout, the, the flyers, the little flyer. Mm-hmm. , , on occasion. But Ross theorized that Oswald had used that address on his literature to embarrass.

Guy Baner and just, he didn’t have an address. He literally just wrote a fucking address on something because he didn’t have an address. Remember he wrote to the, the, the, the main office in New York. You remember that? Well, they, well, they said that they didn’t want him to open one, but he opened one anyways.

Yeah. But then he had an address. Well, he was making what, a dollar 25 . He just having money to do downtown office. I don’t know. Maybe he, well, back in the day, and he remember he got that $400 fucking stipend from the government to come back to the us. But he had a little, little stash, little stashed away.

Maybe he was bankrolled by, , I know, but what, what’s his name? Shaw guy. Yeah, yeah. Clay Shaw. Yeah. Clem Clay Shaw was like sound payment. So in 66, , garrison’s investigation led him to conclude that a group of right wing extremists, which included fair.

Guy Banister were involved, , with certain parts of the CIA in a conspiracy to kill Kennedy. Garrison would later claim that the motive for the assassination was anger over Kennedy’s attempt to obtain a peace settlement in Cuba and Vietnam. Garrison also claim, came to believe that New Orleans businessman, clay Shaw was part of the conspiracy and that Clay Shaw was his pseudo name for Clay Bertran.

Garrison believed that Shaw Banister Ferry conspired to set up Oswald as a patsy to kill jfk. Mm-hmm. , I mean, see to me that makes possibly the most sense because as you probably concluded, listeners, after listening to the last episode like Lee Harvey Oswald is like, he’s like the one kid at the party who like, We’ll do anything, just like be cool just to get part, like literally they’re like, he’s like, yeah, you kicked me in the nuts for sure.

And you’re like, you know, like, like he’s so desperate to be relevant cuz he’s been not on irrelevant and everything he’s ever done in his entire life has been like super subpar and like shit. Yeah. That like he would be like, fuck, I’m gonna be the man . And they’re like, yeah man, you’re the man. And they’re like, this guy’s a fucking return

They’re like, we’re gonna totally got this guy. This guy got. So on March 1st, 1967, Garrison arrested and charged Shaw with conspiring to assassinate Kennedy on January 29th in 69. Shaw was brought to trial on these charges and the jury came to the conclusion and found him not guilty. Dun, dun. I mean it’s really, that’s, yeah.

There is it, it’s all the, all the evidence is like, is like circumstantial. It’s not like really hard. It, like, there’s nothing, right. Like, like documents, like, you know, I know there’s nothing. Yeah. But that’s what, you know, makes it cool. Part of being a conspiracy. I know. Yeah. Because like, but he was grasping at straws from a legal standpoint.

He was grasping at straws from a legal standpoint. Yeah. Yeah. But from like a human standpoint, you’re like, yeah, I know you did this motherfucker. And, but it’s like, I can’t prove it, but I know you did it, but at least you did of something. Yeah. At least you did. I kind of, I kind of kind of go like, cuz I’ve seen all of, um, Oliver Stone even came out with a new documentary later on.

Oh. And. . It’s like further evidence since new documents were released. And it’s a documentary. It’s not a Kevin Coster, no. Mm-hmm. . It’s a docu, yeah. And, um, you know, he, he spends a lot of time breaking down the holes that exist in all of it. You know what I mean? Yeah. And so there’s quite a few, and that’s, that’s why I think the conspiracy has persisted for so long.

Cause like there’s so many, like there’s nothing concrete. Yeah. It’s like, yeah. Okay. It’s just even down to the fact that he used the shitiest gun on earth. I know. Like, shit, it never ends. It’s the worst possible ends. Like, come on. Like it never ends. It’s ridiculous. It’s hilarious. , okay, so going forward right now, we went over Oliver Stone’s scenario and, and in the seventies.

So now, from a history standpoint, , , rfk. Robert Kennedy was killed in, I think 69 or 68 ish. Mm-hmm. , uh, and Robert Kennedy was the attorney General Yeah. Of the United States. He, his brother. Yeah. That’s a whole other one that I really we’re do a, it’s a good one. Great podcast on that. So you stay, stay tuned for that

Yeah. , then Martin Luther King Jr. Was killed. Mm-hmm. , he was also assassinated. So the, the government put together something called the United States House of Representatives Select Committee on Assassinations. And this was to dive in further, like, how are these going on? Yeah. More so. Yeah. Everybody’s getting killed.

Yeah. Like, fuck yeah. Everybody’s getting killed. This was put together in 76, , it completed its investigation in JFK in 1978. And it, it issued the final, , their report the following year and it concluded that Kennedy was probably assassinated as a result of a conspiracy. Wow. See, fucking our shit is like proven by the state.

That’s crazy. I mean, they did say that. They’re like, Hey, they don’t say, they don’t say like, what the fuck happened? Well, cause they, they’re probably not allowed to speculate further. Here’s the really weird part. Their speculation. Yeah. Here’s a really weird part and I, this is where I would love some emails from people.

Please hear from you. What’s the email? Uh, info the conspiracy podcast.com. All right. So, or actually Spotify. You can leave a Yeah, comment. So the confusing part to me is that they say at the beginning or they say in their, I guess, results or their conclusion of investigation, that it was probably. A result of conspiracy, right? Mm-hmm. . But then later on they say literally, here are the conclusions from the committee.

You ready? Yeah. They say, Lee Harvey Oswald fired three shots at Kennedy then didn’t hit him. This fired three shots, the second and third shots fired, struck the president. The third shot killed the president. . That’s it then. I mean, they, it’s just so the, I guess what they’re saying, so later on they say they, they do say scientific acoustical evidence establishes a high probability that two gunmen fired at the president.

Oh, yeah. Yeah. So that’s right. Okay. That’s, that’s what I’m saying. Like, cuz I remember that they, they, they set up, I remember I saw like a video on it. They, they set up, yeah. On the street and like, pretty much everywhere. They shut the whole place down. Yeah. And they set up all these like, acoustic things or whatever Oh.

To see like that. And they’re trying to recreate it and they’re like, no, it’s not, it’s possible. Yeah. It’s not probable that it was all shot from. Okay. So maybe what they, they determined is they don’t know who did it. That’s pretty much what they’re saying. They’re saying, okay. They’re saying agree to disagree

Right? Yeah. They’re saying, they’re saying that Oswald did it, but with somebody else. Yeah. But there was like, yeah, like homie like, yeah. Who helped then they say, uh, other scientific evidence does not preclude the possibility of two gunmen firing at the president. Scientific evidence negate some specific conspiracy allegations. So they’re saying some of it is bullshit, but some of it is, but of it possible they can’t prove it’s wrong. Yeah. So it’s like, it’s possible that it’s, that it’s gonna happen.

So the committee believes on the basis of the evidence available that Kennedy was probably assassinated as a result of a conspiracy. I see. So it wasn’t it wasn’t like a one-man show. Yeah. The committee was unable to identify the other godman or to what extent of the conspiracy. So they’re like, right.

It was a conspiracy. We just don’t know anything else. , but then they keep going. Right. So just to, to nix some of the things it says, the committee believes. That on the basis of evidence available that the Soviet government was not involved. Hmm. I would personally agree with that. Okay. This is me. So then the next one, the, so the committee believes on the basis of the evidence available to it that the Cuban government was not involved.

All right. Okay. Okay. The committee believes on the basis of the evidence available that anti-Castro Cuban groups were not involved in the assassination, but that the available evidence does not preclude the possibility that individual members of those of said groups were involved. Well, that Castro or poor don’t know anti-Castro because they’re like Castro cub, because JFK was trying to make peace with Castro.

Yeah. To like fucking chill things out. Right, right. And so they’re like, fuck Castro. Yes. You, you’re a sympathizer. You, you, you gotta die too. Yeah. Yeah. The committee also believes, On the basis of the evidence available to us. I know, God, it like job, job. Seriously. Like copy, copy, paste on my fucking that the national syndicate of organized crime as a group was not involved.

How the fuck would they know though? Like somebody sna That’s what, that’s what I was saying. Like that’s how they know on the evidence available, which is none. . The Secret Service. The Secret Service. The fbi. The CIA were not involved in the association. Of course, of course, of course, of course. They’re like, come on.

They’re like definitive proof. Yeah. That they are not involved. , I gotta throw ’em under the bus. The committee further concluded that it was probable that four shots were fired. The four shot came from a second assassin located on the grassy Knoll.

Exactly. Oh. So they’re like saying, but missed. . Oh, they weren’t a sharp shooter. . We’re never gonna let that joke die. H S C A, which a house of subcommittee of assassinations yeah. Concluded the existence and location of this alleged fourth shot based on the later discredited Dallas Police Department recording analysis.

So the H S C A agreed that with a single bullet theory. So that was the magic bullet where Yeah. Where it went through like seven parts of his body. Yeah. Yeah. So they, they agreed with the single bullet theory, but concluded that it occurred at a, at a time point during the assassination that differed from any several points.

The Warren Commission theorizing really, it happened. So here is a very important part. Oh, I see. Yeah, yeah. To my, to, to my, my belief of this. Yeah. Which, . Yeah. So remember when we were talking about, and we were arguing how many, how many shots could you get off in six seconds? Yeah, in six seconds. Yeah. Yeah.

That’s saying it wasn’t six seconds. What? So Cause cuz basically it’s saying, they’re saying that timeline’s wrong. Right? Well, how Right before that they said it was longer. They think it was four shots. They think it was four shots over a longer period of time rather than six seconds where you had to go pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop, pop.

No, but my thing is like if there’s, there’s still theorizing that that Oswald shot three of those shots, but his, his, his window of opportunity to hit him in the back, like at, at the back had to be so slim. That car. Okay. Let’s say the car’s trying even five miles an hour. It’s so much different than 15 seconds.

I still don’t think, I still don’t, do you know what I mean? Yeah. I just don’t think it’s 15 seconds. I just don’t think the, the window of opportunity from that vantage point, especially after the first shot, you think like homie would like hit the gas. Yeah. Like the driver’s gonna be like, oh, just keep going two miles an hour.

You think he would , maybe I should get the fuck outta here. Yeah. Yeah. So that’s what I’m saying. I understand maybe six seconds isn’t the correct timeframe. I still don’t believe it would be greatly above that. Yeah. At all. Yeah. So what you think like eight seconds or somethings? Maybe. Yeah, but that’s what, when somebody comes to me and they say, oh, how could you do that?

The man liquor in six seconds? I’m like, you can’t. It’s impossible. Yeah. But doesn’t, why is it six seconds? I know. I don’t know who came up with a six second. Yeah. You know what I mean? That’s point, it’s usually like audio, , oh, it’s a pop, pop, pop on the recruiter film. Or like when were the shots. But then you have delayed you, you know, you have a rifle shot and maybe the sound, you know what I mean?

Like it a lot of, all different, yeah. There’s a lot of variables. But I just know that there are protocols in place. I don’t know them cause I’m not in, I’m not in the secret service, but like there are protocols in place for. Those type of situations, you know, shots fired, like your, you, your immediate next act is, okay, I need to escape.

Like get out. Like, you know, it’s not, well they did, you know, if you remember like they secret service was right behind him, then they run up to the car and then they jump on and they’re trying to like, protect him at that point. Then they take off. I don’t know how many seconds that was true. But yeah, to your point, like it, it should have happened faster, but it didn’t, I mean, first of all, nobody’s expecting that You should be prepared for anything, but yeah, you shouldn’t.

Um, I don’t know. I, yeah, I, I definitely think there was another shooter. Fully agree. I fully agree that a second shooter Yeah. Who, who was an actual sharp shooter? Whoa, whoa, don’t up. Yeah. We’re not jumping, I’m not jumping, jumping. Well, you said fourth shot. I’m just adding a, I’m just, well, the sprinkling a little more to the conspiracy.

It’s conspiracy. Sprinkle. So, so they, they, they went further and they said the Department of Justice, the fbi, the cia and the Warren Commission were all criticized for not revealing to the Warren Commission information that was available in 64. Ooh, you fucking dicks. Oh. Then it was determined that the Secret service was deemed deficient.

In their protection of the president of the United States. Yeah. No shit. . Well, remember last of us, we talked about how the FBI had like homie like in the lobby, and they’re like, yeah, that never happened. Yeah, . They’re like, but we have the records. We’re like, fuck . So, and then they, they, they talk further about like how, you know, uh, the secret surface should have come forward more to the Warren Commission.

Provided more information, more, I guess the word is responsibility of like, hey, yeah, but they just lost weed. Fucking yeah. We didn’t do the right thing. Prized person that they have to like take off. They’re so fierce. They must protect. So anyways, so the H S C A found the F B I and CIA A were both deficient in performing their duties.

Oh, a hundred percent. Yeah. , That’s from the committee. Yeah. The hs. H S C A. Yeah, that’s from the committee. So it’s interesting to see like a, an actual, , official entity be like, say , something’s a a little off. And it’s so funny cuz like this, this is a point, like I do feel like whenever someone hears the word conspiracy, it’s instantly like proclaiming to be some far-fetched thing.

But like the actual definition of a conspiracy is like more than one person like deciding to do a thing right? In secret. That’s all a conspiracy is it’s like more than one human. You know what’s crazy is plotting to do a thing. We’ve had multiple messages of that’s not a conspiracy or whatever. Or people talking to us and saying That’s not a conspiracy.

And so I think we should actually define, I will pull up the Miriam what a conspiracy Miriam is because it gives a bad wrap up. It does get a bad wrap here. Here’s the, I’m gonna give you guys the Miriam Webster definition. So the definition of conspiracy is a secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. Mm. That is the definition of conspiracy.

Or one more time. Similar. Similar definition. One more time. One, the action of plotting or conspiring. So to do something unlawful group? No. A secret plan by a group to do something unlawful or harmful. That is definition of a conspiracy. It’s not like crazy for fetched idea. Yeah. By, by right. Wink extremist.

It’s not . It’s. A secret plan by a group. That’s interesting. To do something unlawful or harmful. Yeah. Yeah. So it means by a group means more than one human. So that’s been more than one person, probably more than two. So Lee Harvey, group someone together more. No, no, but I think a group, uh, a you can have a group of two people.

Yeah. As long as it’s not a singular human who’s deciding to make an act on their own. Okay. That’s not a conspiracy. No, it’s not a conspiracy cuz it’s just, it’s just like I’m pissed. Yeah. Yeah. , I’m gonna do something bad. I wanna kill ’em. I know. Kill ’em. Okay, so that’s the house committee. Yeah. Yeah. So the next one.

Mm-hmm. , the next major conspiracy that exists in the JFK assassination is that the, the subsequent president, Lyndon b Johnson, uh, conspired to take him. And become the president of the United States. I mean, that’s the, that’s the, that’s the conspiracy. The conspiracy of, of humankind right. Power. Yeah. Maybe So in 2003, there was a poll to Americans that 20% suspected Lyndon Johnson of Oh, they’re like, I 20% America.

Americans don’t trust that guy. That’s, that’s a lot. Yeah. , and they say basically he plotted the assassination because he disliked the Kennedys as a whole. . How did he get to be the VP then? He was like smiling in loud, man. And he feared that he would be dropped from the Democratic ticket for the reelection.

Ooh. So he was like, I’m on the ask. So it’s, , 64 was his reelections, but he was killed in 60. In 63. Yeah. Yeah. So he was going to. , he was gonna be on the outs and he loses everything. So, but here’s just some interesting info on this conspiracy, is that JFK was seriously considering dropping him from the ticket in favor of, , Terry Sanford, which was the North Carolina governor.

, and so that’s, that’s the main motive behind it. , Kennedy’s personal secretary, which is her name was Evelyn Lincoln, she wrote a book. . Hmm. , and it was, the book was called Kennedy and Johnson, , and that President Kennedy told her that Lyndon b Johnson would be replaced as VP of the United States.

And that that conversation took place three days before the assassination. Ooh. So maybe he had like the inside scoop and they were like, he was like, oh shit. So in the diary or the book or whatever you wanna say, Ms. Kennedy sat in a rocker in, in the office, or Mr. Kennedy sat in the rocker in my office.

His head resting on its back, and he places left leg across his knees. He crossed his legs. He rocked slightly as he talked. Man, this is super stripped. I know in a slow pensive voice. He said to me, you know, if I am reelected in 64, I am going to spend more and more time toward making government service an honorable.

I would like to tailor the executive and legislative branches of government so that they can keep up with the tremendous strides and, and progress being made in the other fields. I’m going to advocate changing some of the outmoded rules and regulations in the existing Congress, such as the seniority rule.

To do this, I will need a running mate in 64 who believes. What I do see, this is back, like this is back when like the Democratic party was actually dope. Yeah. I, this was like back, this is like, I dig. The only thing, dude, this is back, this is back when like the, like the Democrats were like the shit. I agree.

Like, I agree. Now. Now I’m like, ugh. But like back then, dude, you could, you could, those guys were high. Were back. Like JFK gave, it, gave shit in the sixties. I would be a Democrat. A hundred percent. Me too, dude. I, I’m not even let a hundred percent. I would. Maybe the fifties even. A hundred percent. I would, I would’ve been because they like, they were like legit.

So Mrs. Lincoln, her name was Evelyn Lincoln. Mrs. Lincoln went on to write and she said, I was fascinated by this conversation. So much fascinated. I wrote it down verbatim in my diary, especially cuz she’s like, I’m your secretary, why are you telling me this?

Yeah. Now I ask, who is your choice as a running mate? He looked straight ahead and without hesitating, he replied. At this time I am thinking about Governor Terry Sanford of North Carolina, but it will not be Lyndon. Ooh. And Lyn’s got like a, he’s got like a glass against the wall, like Linda. That motherfucker feels good.

So therein, That’s the, I mean that’s, she’s the secretary of, that’s motive Kennedy. That’s motive too. Yeah. Right. I mean, and it’s a big motive because you lose hella power if we have any kind of evidence, any kind. Well this is, this is the evidence that’s, that’s trying to get a paycheck. Don’t have to

Yeah, I know. No, but it’s a little anything at all. No, it’s just her trying to get a paycheck. You think so Someone now it’s her trying to get a paycheck or Right. Not buying. You might be right. Buy or be Right. Not buying at all. All. So just the next person. So there’s this person named Madeline Brown. Yeah.

Uh, she said she was Johnson’s what can the, the like call girl? Yeah. . Booty call like a little mistress. Yeah. No she didn’t. Johnson didn’t pay. Oh, of course not. Yeah, no, it was freebies. His secretary paid. Yeah. Freebies. . So she says, her name’s Madeline Brown. She says, , He was doing a little like pillow talk with her

Well, she implicated, she basically implicated him in the conspiracy to kill Kennedy. Oh, in 97. Brown said that Johnson, along with somebody named h l Hunt, had begun planning Kennedy’s demise in the early 1960. Brown claimed that by its fruition in 63, the conspiracy involved dozens of people, including fbi, mafia, politicians, journalists, , you know, all these things.

She, there was a documentary called The Men Who Killed Kennedy, , Madeline Brown. Anyway, like, , this gets real complicated with the oil men. , you know that even j Agar Hoover came together and they, he gave the blessing and he said, okay, let’s do it. Gave the blessing . Yeah. Uh, that one’s really fucking out, out there, to be honest.

But Brown reiterated her allegations, , in 2006, , in another documentary. Well, see, the thing about that is like, I, I think the, the real, the true makings of like the best possible conspiracy, especially if it’s true, is to make it seem so outlandish that it won’t be believed. It’s kind of like hiding in the truth.

Exactly. Hide in plain sight. It’s like hide plain sight. You, it’s like how. You know, how could the government actually betray We love you? You know, it’s like, it’s so, like, they couldn’t do that to us. They would never do wrong. We’re in charge. We’re, we’re, are we, you know, that’s why, that’s why I always, I’m always on the side of like, if, if the government’s involved always like, well, you know, anything can happen if the government’s involved.

Like, you know, they made that movie with, with Tom Cruise where he is like running Coke for the fucking cia. That’s like what movie? That’s a true story. What movie that it’s called, uh, what the fuck is it called? Um, it’s Oh, made America Made, made. Something like that. Made I think, I think something American Made.

No, but I’m saying, but that’s a true story. Yeah. Yeah. He was actually doing that, so it’s like, it’s so, it’s so weird that we’re , oh, but I. , he was literally running coke for the C Like, , and that’s proven.

Yeah. , they’ve all admitted that that was true. , what the fuck? , so there’s a lot of people, literally, I have three pages of different people who said that Johnson was conspiring to do it. Hmm. There’s in 84, a convicted guy named Billy Sol. Estes made a statement, , that Johnson had inside knowledge on the death of Kennedy.

Um, Howard Hunt, who was part of Watergate, if you ever Oh yeah. Really researched Watergate. He was a big figure in Watergate. He said that, , you know, he had firsthand knowledge that Johnson knew about it and allowed it to happen. , you know, there’s a lot, there’s a lot. I, I don’t wanna say that they’re reliable sources, but there are people, but if enough, if enough people say something like, you have to give it merit. Yeah. It’s like you saying there could only be so many coincidence before know start to like add up. Yeah. I know there’s another guy, uh, political consultant, but he was also a convicted felon named Roger Stone.

He believed that Johnson orchestrated Kennedy’s assassination. , he also claims that Raphael Cruz, , who is the father of, of Ted Cruz. You know Ted Cruz? Oh, I know Ted Cruz and my man. Oh yeah. So he’s the father of Ted Cruz. He was tied to Lee Harvey. Anyway, there’s just, I feel, I feel there’s, , obviously there is gonna be.

They’re probably 30 to 40% of it is additional bullshit. Yeah. People just like adding stuff on, like just trying to get their , you know, 15 minutes of fame. , oh yeah, by the way, guess who else was involved? , you know, they’re adding shit in there, right? Mm-hmm. . So anyways, that’s the Lyndon Johnson one.

, that one, you know, it’s more believable than the umbrella man. Yeah. . No, there’s that for sure. Like hundred percent. We do have that. Yeah, we do have that in comparison. That’s true. But, uh, I mean, we’ll talk about it at the end. Yeah. But at the same time, I don’t know, it’s so hard. There’s so much. It sounds like everybody’s just trying to get, get theirs.

I think j I hit it on the nose . People are just trying to get theirs. Yeah. Oh yeah. And they what I mean, and they’re everyone’s little 15 minutes of fame. Yeah. They’re so selfish. And it’s , that’s why , people have done far worse things to get power. I mean, just look at the history of the, the human race.

It is literally, yeah, it just sh strewn with just murder and fucking betrayal. Just to usrt power. Look at the Killed fucking, the killed Caesar. And he was a dub dude rap. Granted he became a tyrant, but , whatever, you know, granted, granted, granted, you know. Yeah. But hey, before that he was chill.

Super chill. We have, we have, uh, we have two, we have two more. Uh, before that he was chill

you know, just saying. Then he was, he did all the good vibes. Good vibes. He became a tyrant. Did good vibes only before he was like, I run this bitch

live laugh. Caesar

Okay. So, uh, at a certain point in time they sealed the, , a lot of the government documents about jfk Yeah. In the investigation. And it was a 50 year seal. Jesus. That’s a wild, the long ass seal. But no, no. Think about it. This is 63. So 50 years. Oh. So yeah, that’s a freedom of information act too, like . So, uh, a few years ago, a lot came out.

There is a person named Mr. Donald Trump who extended that time period because he felt that it should be extended really more years. Yeah. So Donald Trump extended it how many more years? So I think it was five. So it’s now Biden has to random. So I think Biden we’re gonna 50.

He didn’t wanna deal. He’s like, didn’t wanna, don’t wanna deal with this. I’m wanna get all this heat, like fucking shit. Like, so, but some was released, , and then I think it was put, and then the other parts were pushed forward a little bit. 

In 2017, uh, 55,000 documents were released. Whoa. On the release. That’s not a small amount of documents. Yeah. , and it’s just gonna take a long time to go through all those documents. Well, yeah. So not a lot of things, but there are a couple things that are related to Jack Ruby that came to light mm-hmm.

that were a little bit like confusing or. Jack Ruby is the guy who killed Oswald in the garage. Downstairs, correct? In the, in the garage. Yeah. Club owner. He was like a club owner. Yeah, he was a club owner. He really, what’s crazy about Jack Ruby is he wanted to be part of everything.

Yeah. He was hanging out at the cop station now club, talking about like strip clubs and shit. Right? Strip clubs. Oh yeah. He used to host like some of the biggest celebrities, politicians, mafia guys, all the, and that’s where the ties, the mafia comes in with Ruby. Yes. Because of the, the, the company that he would keep.

Yes. Yeah. Yes. Now, I just wanna say out the gate, I don’t like that tie just because for example, if you were a, like a mob of Cincinnati, like you were the, the chief of Cincinnati. Yeah. Just cuz you go to a strip club doesn’t mean you are. Affiliated with tight, with the homie, with the owner. Well, I mean, how often like, you’re there to that strip club though?

Yeah, but you’re just there for the strip club . Maybe you’re not And you’re like, and Jacks like over there like, Hey, I’m like, I’m like, leave me alone and Jacks, I’m not here for you. No. And then later, you know, Jack would be like, yeah, I know Sean . He just like Name Drop Sean. Yeah. Oh, you’re talking about the drug dealer from Cincinnati.

Oh, that motherfucker. Yeah, I know Sean name dropping. He is like, look, there’s pictures of us. I got selfies of the titty. So you see, you see how like, that’s how I believe he’s associated with the mob. I, I agree. He’s just anty. Is this a And he’s like, just wants to be in the thing. No, but it’s not like it’s Tony Soprano titty bar.

No, it’s just a regular, it’s a regular titty bar. That’s right. . That’s right. So, uh, but what was interesting in these documents is that, , and if, for those who are. gonna criticize us. So document 3 2 1 4 9 2 67. Jesus Christ. Fucking real. Yeah. Jesus. So document 3 2 1 4 9 2 67. Okay.

why is there so many numbers? There’s a lot of fucking document. 5,000. Yeah. So it says, quote, recently a group manager in Dallas Intelligence Division received information from a confidential informant that might be helpful in the investigation of the Kennedy assassination. The informant stated, uh, on the morning of the assassination, Ruby contacted him and asked if he would like to watch the fireworks.

Oh wow. He was with Jack Ruby and standing at the corner of the postal annex building that was facing the Texas school book Depository. And that was at the time of the shooting. , that’s little. Wow. I, I, but I personally hate so confidential informant. I know. I fucking hate that. So later on though, it was discovered that the informant is named Bob Vander.

Slice. The fuck the called the rat name. Call Rat. Rat. The rat. The rat. Not the rat. Um, fucking true, fucking snitch. So the, so that’s Bob Vander slice. He relayed this information to the F FBI handlers in 77, but in the document, it doesn’t state why it took him 14 years to tell them. maybe cuz his last name’s fucking Vander slice.

Oh, he’s, because for 14 years he is like, I ain’t 14 years. I, and then later on he decided he got a deal, he got, he got arrested. He, he got like arrested like a, like blowing a stop sign. He’s like, I got get me off . I got something for you. I got the right shit. Only if you let me go. I’m gonna tell you what happened 15 years ago.

Confidential format. So, but the file goes on to say that as soon as this shooting occurred, Ruby turned headed for the Dallas Morning news building and he didn’t say a single word to the guy Vander slice. That’s weird. So if the f inform funny, if he’s like enjoy the fireworks, then he just like leaves right before

I’m out here. So if, if the informant is to be believed. So if we believe this story by Vander slice, Bob Vander slice Ruby was among the crowd who saw JFK get shot and he seemed to have prior knowledge of what was about to happen with his fireworks comment. Yeah. so conspiracy theorists tied Ruby to the assassination via organized crime.

They believe that mafia are the ones behind the wider one, . Mentioned by the house selective committee. But see I think mm-hmm. that like first, there are two things on that. Just on this particular one. Yeah. The fireworks thing is, is a loose thing. Cuz like the fireworks gonna be like, Hey the president’s coming, do you wanna see the fireworks?

The president’s gonna be here and it’s gonna be great. Yeah. And maybe that’s a fireworks presentation. Afterwards, you know, maybe like I know but they canceled it cuz he got fucking killed so there’s no more fireworks. Yeah. But the other thing is the mob, they don’t want to, I don’t think they’d want to be involved with something.

That high profile. Yeah. The mom, the mob. The mob it seems pretty, very forever, has always been in the shadows. They don’t want to be involved with this high profile shit. Even when, , , uh, man, God, when was it? This was in New York and they had one of, like, one of the mob bosses, , Colombo I think was just getting super fucking political about shit and like was trying to get Italian rights and they were , fucking stop it.

What are you doing? Like stop doing this. And then they end up killing him. But, you know, that’s what I’m saying. I don’t think the mob wants to be involved with something. The, the highest possible profile you can get. Right. Killer. The president. I mean, uh, we’re kind of at the end of Ruby, which is , . A lot of people say, oh, maybe he had, there was mob debt and , you know, but I don’t know why that would have to do with Ruby having mob debt and you know what I mean, kill JFK for brilliant.

But Ruby died in jail, uh, from an embolism in 67. What was he in jail for? What was. killing Lee Harvey Oswald. Oh, that’s, oh yeah, that’s right. . Yeah. Oh, totally forgot about that one. Whoops. It is. He . So, uh,

makes sense. If you’re gonna saw Eric’s face. Yeah. Killingly like, what are you, literally, I thought we did this, we’ve done this for five hours. Yeah. Okay. He never did. Yeah. Like, never spit, spill the tea. Something, , he said, he actually said, , that he lucked out on being able to enter the garage.

He was like, there was no security. There was no, it was like, let him in. He’s , yeah. I, I didn’t know I was gonna kill him at that moment. He j it was just an opportunity. You were Oh. Oh, sweet. Oh, you’re, you’re guy. You’re right open. You’re right here. Pop, 

I’m gonna kill you. Yeah. So he never, you know, so anyways, and then he died in 67 and. . Yeah. And that’s, you never know. You know what I mean? 

So they have a whole wall in like a bunch of different conspiracy theories. And you were just talking about the mafia, the mob. And so it reminded me of this, and there was one theory about, um, the Cuban government. Many people suspected that Fidel Castro or his government were behind the Kennedy assassination.

Oswald was pro Castro and attempted to visit Cuba in September, 1963. Right. Disclosures during the mid 1970s that the CIA was involved in two plots to kill Fidel Castro. One using the mafia. Ooh. Okay. So the CIA was basically , using the mafia to, to kill Fidel Castro and, , suspicions that Kennedy might have been killed in retaliation.

Yeah. So, but then it goes on to say the house committee, you know, found no evidence of this or whatever. Like, you just kind of touched on that point there before. But yeah, I just thought it was interesting. So the CIA working with the mafia, I mean, that, that’s, that doesn’t sound weird to me. Exactly. , you were just talking about that.

That’s not farfetched. That sounds, that sounds about right. It’s weird. I mean, I do kind of think it’s weird that he went to Cuba and he went, you know what I mean?

Mm-hmm. , he went to Mexico City. Right. And he, yeah. All those things are weird. And they’re weird. Russia or Soviet Union, whatever. Yeah. So they’re all, he lived there for a weird, yeah. Yeah. Okay. , , so the final, , conspiracy that I have here is, , and I, I call it the, it was an accident conspiracy. Uh, honestly, this might be my favorite one. , here we go. You ready? Oops. So a majority of this, , story or the script or whatever is taken from, , somebody named Daniel Arkin.

, And he’s a writer, and I just wanted to give him the credit because a majority of this, this written word is, is from him. Uh, but here’s the theory of it was an accident. . I didn’t mean to do it, bro. So the theory is that after Lee Harvey Oswald fired multiple shots, the motorcade Karen Kennedy, a secret service agent riding in the car that was immediately behind the presidential limousine, he grabbed his colt ar 15, his rifle to return fire cuz he heard shots, the shooting.

So he grabs his fucking AR 15. So, but when his car stopped immediately, . The theory says that Agent George Hickey, oh my fucking George, goddamn, George Hickey lost his balance. like pulled the trigger four times, accidentally discharged his weapon, sending a, it says a, a flurry a 2 23 caliber. Yeah. 2 23. 2 23 Caliber 2 23 is a normal, uh, normal air caliber, huh?

That in 5 56. So he , accidentally discharged his 2 23 caliber round, rocketing into Kennedy’s head. come into his head. Why the adjectives, why rocketing? Well, he’s a writer. You know, I know it’s a gun. Of course, it’s rocketing rockets into Kennedy’s head, and that’s the wound that killed the president.

And so this guy’s like it was al. Yeah, . So the idea is that the Oswald Secret, you know what? We’re not cooperating with you right now, . So, so here’s the theory is that, , you know, in without script, right? Mm-hmm. , the theory is Oswald shot, Oswald sucked. He missed, yeah. We already have evidence that he missed with evidence that he tried to kill somebody else and miss, and missed from a very easy range.

So he went and he shot, and then Agent Hickey fucking freaked out this trigger. Happy they are 15 and it mis fired. and that was the end headshot. Did you know, that actually is probably like the most plausible. I know, right? Come back crazy. It’s probably the, it’s a crazy theory. It’s like the most realistic theory that I can ever imagine.

Okay. So I’m just gonna give you a couple, a couple of minutes of like, maybe like backup evidence on this. Okay. . Okay. So 20 years ago, , there’s somebody named Maner and he wrote a book called Mortal Air, the shot that killed jfk. And it was a book that, that premise on the work of, uh, somebody named Howard Donahue.

He was a firearms expert who in 67 began probing the ballistic and forensic evidence. And he concluded that Hickey was the elusive second gunman. Oh. Because he was behind him and it was just cold. He was behind. Yeah. It was a friendly fire. Yeah. You know what I mean? So over nearly a quarter of a century, Donahue reportedly poured over evidence, tons of evidence, and it included the locations, the diameter of the entrance of the exit wounds in Kenny.

Shit. So he’s getting, he’s getting like scientific on that shit, the trajectory of the ex and the explosive impact of the fatal bullet, uh, that testimonies from witnesses who smelled gun smoke near the motorcade. Mm. Right. And this is the grassy Noel smelling, but it’s just, you know, in the area, it’s just like the space in the area on all fronts.

Manager, the guy who, the expert. Yeah. The evidence pointed squarely at Hickey. as an accidental job. That’s crazy. But no eyewitnesses have gone on record claiming to scene Hickey firing a shot because no Secret Service, no secret service had said any of this. They ain’t gonna say, oh no, they’re never gonna protect their own, bro.

Yeah, but let me, let me, I have a question. Yeah. So was this guy, he, he was in the car behind mm-hmm. , the Kennedy car, right? Mm-hmm. . Okay. Was he one of the ones outside riding on the side, or was he inside the car and if he was inside the car, is there any kind of he like shell casing or like Yeah, or maybe like it penetrated the, the windshield, right?

Ooh. Or maybe, no, it was maybe like drop top. It was like convertible. Maybe it was like sitting up the, the, the one in the back was as well. I don’t know. No, I think the one in the back was not a backdrop. The, the car, right. The car right behind him was a regular car, and it had the, the, what do you call it?

Like the sidestep? I know, yeah. The, the guys on the side. Yeah. Yeah. That’s a great question

Hickey was seated in the car behind. Oh, okay. So he was not on the uh, you know the side. The side side. So he shot through the windshield? Yeah, exactly. Of the car behind? Yeah. No, he stood up. Oh. So it’s a convertible. Yeah. Oh, okay. It was good. Okay. Stood up and then pop, pop, pop, pop, pop. Okay. Yeah. So he stood up.

So, but he, you know, pointed it exactly in the right direction. Or maybe it was like on a hip, like a hip fire. Yeah. So, but again, so there’s seven other people in that car. None of them testified. They’re probably all Dan, they’re probably all hung themself in, in a prison with, with the cameras all . But none of them, none of them said, none of them said shots were fired outta their car.

None of them said bullets were whizzing. None of them said anything. See, it’s like a brotherhood. It’s like, you can’t, you can’t, you can’t, you can’t, you can’t rat on your head. But nonetheless, a manager book, he, he put it out the book in 92. Uh, and, you know, . There you go. I’m pretty sure OJ killed Kennedy.

Yeah, if, if there was reports of the gunpowder smell, like you definitely wouldn’t catch a catch a whiff from the sixth floor of the book. Depository . Catch a whiff all the way down to the grassy kno. . Ooh. So, so like gun powder. So now just the last thing on Hickey, right? Yeah. Is in the Warren Commission.

It said the following. Okay. In the Warren Commission it said, special agent George Hickey in the rear seat of the presidential follow-up car, picked up and coxed an automatic rifle as he heard the final shot. At this point, the cars were speeding through the underpass and had left the scene of the shooting, but Hickey kept the automatic , weapon ready as the car raced to the hospital.

So the Warren Commissioners just saying that he was cocked and ready, he had it. He stood up, cocked ready. , but he didn’t discharge. Didn’t discharge. Mm-hmm. . Hmm. That’ss the end of, I mean, that’s the end of the hickey conspiracy. You know what I mean? That’s, I mean, the hickey one is like, isn’t it great? It’s a good one.

That’s so great. I had never heard that one before. I’ve never heard it either, but I’m like, you know, I can see that happening. Yeah. Because like, you’re so, like, I know, you’re like your fucking adrenaline’s cranked. Yeah. Like right. Your fingers on your fingers in the trigger. You accidently pull it. I know you don’t.

And just a random. I know. It just fucking bing. So here we are. This is, , this is the culmination of the, the moment of, yeah. Yeah. Both of us visiting. I mean, you know, we visited, um, book depository, book depository, and instead on the.

All, all the things. And, and we went through, we went through Lee Harvey Oswald, the Warren Commission, the conspiracies. I mean, who’s gonna go first? The summary of what happened to JFK and the people involved and , you know, the Yeah. Understanding the, the, the various individuals who you know, because obviously it gives you, when you’re making it the conclusion on something, you should probably know what you’re making the conclusion on.

Yeah. Not just like, yeah, I think this where I think that. Exactly. So like, who wants to go? I’ll go. I’ll go cuz I, I’ve got, but I need a finite No, I’m give you a vaguery, no . Like, you know what I mean? I’m gonna give you a finite, I’m gonna give you the finite. Finite, yeah. I. That Lee Harvey Oswald was Patsy, I believe Lee Harvey Oswald did fire shots at jfk.

Okay. But I believe the Lee Harvey osd he fire though, was a k, not, he was just a shitty shot. Mm. And he really wanted to be somebody. And this was his, this was his way to be somebody. Mm-hmm. . And I believe, I believe that the government was intimately involved in orchestrating this. I don’t know who killed, I don’t know the exact person who killed jfk, but I do believe that they used Lee Harvey Oswald because he was a very easy tool to be manipulated and used mm-hmm.

And they were , look, they’re gonna have a, , they’re gonna , Hey, you shoot him. They, but they had a contingency in play because they’re , we’re gonna make sure he dies, but you shoot him. Right. So I believe he shot fucking whiff, just totally biffed it. Like just fucking didn’t hit shit. And then, then the real person shot him.

But I do believe the government was wiled. But where do, where, who do you think. Pulled the trigger that killed him. Where from, so you think there was another shooter? Oh no, I think, I think Grassy. No, for sure. Oh, you think? No, I think, I think Grassy. No, I think that, I think the guy set up propped up.

Easy shot. Boom. Was the head umbrella maybe the head shot? No, it was not, it was not umbrella, man. I believe what happened was, I think Oswald probably got off two shots, fucking missed. And then, and then homie was, well, maybe he got how the neck one, maybe he got the neck one like on accident.

I think the one that killed him, the one that actually went through his head, yeah. Was, was from the grassy? No, from a professional. Hmm hmm. If that was from an actual professional, because as we alluded to and, and yes, in the last episode, Lee Harvey Oswald had a fucking shot that my daughter can make.

And he missed And he and and he hit the general. General, yeah, the general. And he hit the windowsill. Yeah. I’m like, the dude’s just sitting in his desk. Waiting to get killed. It’s interesting, it’s interesting that that story, while it should, it should help his case of being an assassin, doesn’t it?

Actually anti, because he missed. Missed, he missed an easy shot from 30. So now hes got a moving target. I know from a moving target. From a, from a high angle. What’s a six floor story? Six. Six? Yeah, six floor. And he is probably easily, I would say minimum, 50 yards minimum. And this other shot was 20, not 50 yards or so, but Yeah.

But we talked about it in another episode. It doesn’t once you’re there, it doesn’t seem, yeah. Doesn’t seem that hard. That hard. Yeah. It doesn’t seem. on a non-moving target maybe, but on a moving target, then on a moving target, did a moving target. It’s, it’s very whole easy for me to say because right, because we’re sitting in chairs talking into microphones and I’m sitting, I’m , oh, these boxes are nice and comfortable.

You know what I mean? . I’m in the book depository, you know, like the books and the thing. He’s holding the gun. Yeah, he’s holding the gun. And then he has to reload the gun bolt action. Yep. And it’s, I’ve shot, I’ve shot a lot of guns in. It’s different when I’m on a tripod. Yeah. And it’s perfectly fucking still.

Yeah. I’m, you also have, you also have it say, is it, what was it, a $20 rifle dude. Literally you, it’s gonna be, isn’t it a 20 Mac rifle? It’s used too. It used, used, used. Yeah. It’s 20 bucks back then. Come on now. It was just the accuracy has gotta be less. I’ve shot expensive, fucking nice rifles, dialed in, scopes and everything at, at, at 50 and a hundred yards stationary on a tripod.

And I’m still not I’m not hitting bullseye. No, no. And I’m a good shot. , yeah. And, and if you go on our, uh, social media or our website or whatever, we’ll put a, a picture of the rifle too. Yeah. And it’s, it’s, , one of those that has a shorter, , the barrel. Barrel. The barrel. So Really?

Yeah. Yeah. So, which makes it even less accurate. Is that right? Oh, yeah. What shorter barrel will. . Yeah, because the barrel. But what’s the point of having a short barrel? It’s more, it’s just ease of u ease. Like it’s, yeah, it’s, you have a faster, no, it’s not about shooting faster, it’s just about like carrying and like transport.

Oh, okay. Because obviously like the longer it’s compact, a barrel, a barrel makes it out cuz the rifling and a barrel. Yeah. It makes the bullet spin and the, and the more the bullet spins, the, the, the more it won’t move or deviate from its course. Okay. So , if you have a longer barrel, it, it’s, it’s gonna start, it’s gonna spin fucking more and it’s gonna be like bing.

Yeah. Okay. All right. I mean, I, I, Jorge, I think, yeah. Give, gimme a conclusion here, Jorge. Yeah. So conclusion would be that there was definitely, like I come to you more than I’m, I Uhhuh, I’m, I come to you at a bar. Yeah. And I say, who killed Kennedy? Yeah. So I would say that, , kind of very similar to Sean.

Like it, you know, Lee Lee was definitely involved. I believe that there was. More people involved. Like really? Yes. Like a definition of a conspiracy. Yeah. It was like a group of people that definitely, you know, used him. Mm-hmm. as the kind of, like the patsy, the decoy, whatever. And de he was definitely very emotionally, politically in, charged, I guess.

Right? Yeah. So he had Oh, he was so, yeah. So he had, he had the motive, but believe Perfect Patsy. He’s the perfect patsy. But you believe he’s shot? I believe he’s shot, I believe like he shot the man lick. Yes. Whether or not he killed him, whatever. I don don’t think he killed him at all. He shot from the window.

I mean, I, I think it’s possible that he hit him once. I think it’s, I think he, I think he might have hit him. Maybe not the kill shot. I don’t think he killed him at all. I don’t think he did the kill shot. No way. Okay. Yeah. Hitting at that. And especially, do you kind of like, especially cuz look, if you think he, , if you look at the video when he gets shot and his fucking head explodes.

Yeah. It’s this way. It’s not, it’s not like, . If you’re shooting from the sixth floor, your, your head doesn’t blow up. Yeah. Up. Yeah. Like that way it goes, it would go down. It would like blow his fucking jaw off. , Hmm. That’s what I’m saying. , no, I mean, you’re, you’re not wrong. Sixth floor, bro. Six stories up.

Okay. A story is you’re wrong, but you’re trying to find the perfect angle. No, but I’m saying Correl relates with the sixth floor and the way his head exploded and all that shit. Oh, okay. I’m, I can’t speak on that. I can’t speak on that one story is 12 feet. So six, so that’s 60. That’s, that’s like 80 feet.

80 feet, like 80 feet in the air. Yeah. And you’re gonna mean to tell me that like, if I shoot you from 80 feet, even at a distance, your head’s gonna fucking explode. But it four, I’m not, oh, it’s gonna explode. I’m just saying like, you’re, you’re, you’re trying to tell me it’s gonna explode on the left side of No, no.

Yeah. No. The trajectory of a bullet would be down, but also the guy Connolly got there. This is a magic bullet. Right. It’s not just his head exploded, but there’s another bullet that went bullet all the way through that. The first one, I think that the first, that went through his know, but I mean that dumb luck bullet.

Yeah. Seven Ways. Harvey console, dumb luck bullet is ricochet through his behind. Yeah, I know. What’s what’s funny when I was there, Uh, in Dallas, in that, you know, in that area there. Um, there’s other buildings that had even a better vantage point. Yeah. I don’t know what they’re called. Like the building.

Building did. I think that’s one of ’em. And then there’s another one street. Yeah. And there’s another one kind of like Totally. Um, what do you call, , why are you there? Well, Lee Harvey Hillswood couldn’t get hired by them because he’s, he’s got the worst resume on the, his maybe. Yeah. But you don’t need to be hired, if you’re just gonna go in there, you know, just to do, just to do this assassination.

No, but you’re gonna walk in with a rifle and they’re gonna be , yeah, go ahead to the sixth floor. Yeah. right in. Walk right in, sir. Okay. So you think if you had to summarize, I, I think that he, he shot probably took the first shot. Yeah. I think there was definitely another person in the Grasso area Yeah.

That had to kill a shot and, Hmm. That they. , you know, that there’s probably a group of them that were just conspiring on how to, you know, cool. Like a group? Yes. I would say , probably four of ’em. We just went over on the, the whole , Oliver Stone. Yeah. Conspiracy theory or whatever of , they helped them.

I’m not saying that government like that they all shot. No, no, no. They, but they were involved in, they planning, planned the planning, planned the execution though. They made the, the, they made the secret service like be lacking. They, they did whatever. Exactly. That’s what I think. Interesting. Okay. What about you?

Eric’s like Leon, Ralphs won kill . There was no conspiracy at all. So I have a lot. I have a lot. So, um, so it’s gotta be concise air. Too concise. It’s gotta be clear, concise. Those dandelions, the dandelions, those your words, sir? No. Um, I have a lot. Um, . There’s a lot of things that I don’t like about the whole story that I don’t like, so I don’t like that he chose to shoot on the way out.

so, oh, that’s right. He could have shot him in the face. Yeah. So you were at the depository. Yeah. And you see, you can see, I think it’s Elm Street or whatever the street is. The one he turns left on his elm. Yeah. So he’s coming at him. Yeah. I would’ve taken that shot. Oh yeah, yeah. Directly. Like he was, look him in the eyes and shit like, right.

Yeah. It seems like a better shot. Yeah. It’s a way better, more time. More ti Way more time. Give him more time. The motion, the motions that I against don’t get that. The motion, I really don’t get against that. Yeah. I mean, hopefully, I mean, maybe I chuck it up to nerves and I can’t look him in the face would kill him.

Yeah. Say like if, just to make I guess the other side of the argument. Yeah. Then he would’ve been found out a lot easier because the, the other way around, it’s like nobody’s, cause he would’ve given away his position. They’re, it came from ahead. Okay. That’s not bad. I’m just saying. Yeah. I don’t know. I don’t think he was that smart though, by the way.

No fucking way. The guy, I mean, the longest job he had six months. He was probably just freaking out. He’s like, oh my God, I can’t do this. And No, no. , I think, , so I don’t like that. I don’t like, I don’t like the Oliver Stones story at all. I, I think they’re all fucking losers. I think fair’s a loser.

I think they’ve shaw’s a loser. I think they’re all, I think they’re all losers. Just kind like that’s Yeah, look, I really want to be part of this. You know? They’re not smart enough to like do hook. Yeah. Like maybe they fucking moved a box and then they think they’re part of something, you know? And I just don’t like any of it.

I, you know, I think it’s a farfetched whatever. Um, I think . Oswald shot, uh, I think he’s shot. And, um, there’s a door that is open within my mind that there was some help. Did, I actually just thought of something. Just the door that makes sense. Just a little bit of a door. But like everything, there’s nothing that says.

that he got help. Well, that’s why we’re talking about it. Otherwise, it wouldn’t be a conspiracy. It was just like, open shut this, you didn’t see the acoustics pointed in two shots. All, all of this. There’s nothing that says, well, Eric, I’m gonna, I literally thought of something that’s probably gonna shed some light on this.

No, my mind. All right. Because remember, I, I think it was in episode one or maybe episode two mm-hmm. that I asked you when, when they released the route that, that he was gonna take mm-hmm. and it was like, it was like, it was like a few days. Yeah. It was a few days before, a week, maybe Max. A week prior. Yeah.

And so he, Oswell had worked at the book Depository for what, like two months, three months, something like that. He was not even, not even, yeah. Yeah. So like month maybe. But he had worked there before they released this route. Yes. So he couldn’t plausibly have known that this would be the place that he would shoot JFK at.

and there’s in the odds of it being a random coincidence that it happens. So work at this place that is exact vantage point to shoot the president is zero. Yeah. So who would know what the route would be before they release the route? Maybe somebody in the government. That’s true. Perhaps that’s true.

Well I will give you this. I will give you this. You know what I’m saying? Like that? I think, I think Oswold killed John F. Kennedy. I know. No, no, I know but Well that’s you. Lemme yeah. Lemme keep mind. No one cares what you think. . Lemme give him mine. I think Oswald killed John F. Kennedy. I am uncertain if he had assistance to do it.

I see. Does that make sense? Yeah. I’m unsure. I understand If maybe take a stance there was . No, I’m saying he killed him. Like that’s my stance. I do believe all the evidence points. to him shooting fingerprints, gun, everything. Mm-hmm. witnesses him there. He took the shots. There is no other a actual evidence that shows anything else happened.

But the assistance, the, the Russia scenario, the, the Cubans, he had a perfect spot. Like all of that is just kind of a little strange to maybe he was supported, assisted. Assisted maybe in the killing. He was supported in it. Hmm. But I do think, , and, but you have a doubt about it. I have a doubt, but I do have a doubt.

But it’s second 2% nervous. One of the things percent, two, two 3% of the things that resonated with me was the fact that Lee Harvey Oswald himself, says he was a patsy. I know because he’s the type of guy that been like, know I did it. I’m the man. So here’s a theory, here’s, here’s a theory that I, he would’ve loved the limelight like you would’ve loved.

Here’s a theory that I’ve concocted over this whole experience, concocted. Yeah. Like, like, like he just sick. My theory is that, my theory is that maybe he did want to kill Kennedy and he wanted to assassinate him, right? Yeah, yeah. Totally possible. And he reached out to all his fucking, all his, tell me dumb con like dumb.

Like he emailed them, or No, there’s not, he emailed, he, he wrote them letters. Letters. A text. He wrote them letters and , . No. And maybe, maybe he did get, he recruited, get his involved. Yes. He got help essentially. So he basically kind of was , maybe even bragging. No. And then, and then what happened is he got, they backed out. They backed out, and then something happened. And then he is like, I’m a fucking patsy, because they, they abandoned him.

Oh. So he is , oh, I’m taking the fall alone. Yes. But he’s the type of guy that would want to Yeah. He literally told the Russians, he’s like, fuck USA baby. Why would he say I am a patsy? Meaning that he was, because he was played. For what? So he must have done something Oh, no. To get played? No, that’s what I’m saying.

Yeah. I think, like I told you, I think he, I think he took a shot, but I think he fucking missed and then he got killed and he was probably like, what? And he probably took a shot and was like, fuck I, I missed thought we were on a team. Yeah. He was like, fuck I missed, killed it. Like, he didn’t, he was like, what?

Like the idea, don’t kill him, bro. Like, the idea is, is us three go, Hey, we’re going to, we’re gonna do this. Mm-hmm. , right? Sean’s gotta be down on the grassy. No. Mm-hmm. , he’s gonna. The shot, Jorge is gonna be on the fucking post Atlantic. I’m gonna be waving an umbrella. Yeah. . He’s gonna be in the black umbrella and I’m gonna be in the book Depository.

Right. And at the end, this is actually a great analogy or a great similar story, is the assassination of, of Abraham Lincoln. Uh, I’m gonna, I’m gonna tell you that whole story on another podcast. Yeah. But there were three other conspirators who backed out. Oh. They’re like, can’t do it. And they were just supposed to kill the other cabinet members.

Oh. And, and Will spoon. They fucking backed out and Wil spoon like Yeah. Did. And he is , where’re the other shots. Yes. . Fuck. What they wanted to do was take down the entire governor, the regime. You Yes. Yes. Damn. So Booth could have said, I’m a patsy because, or not Patsy, but like, I was abandoned Yeah.

By my homies. Yeah. Abandoned. Because, but, but if you actually look up what a patsy pat means, I’m gonna do this real quick. . A patsy is a person who is easily taken advantage of, especially by being cheated or blamed for something. Hmm. Yeah. It’s different. So it’s like you’re taking advantage of, it’s not it got bailed on my, my dogs.

Well, I don’t, I don’t, I don’t really know if he knew that. Miriam Webster’s version of what it mean. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Anyways, all I’m saying is that, is that maybe, maybe, you know, maybe he felt abandoned by other people that he was conspiring.

That’s a totally, I understand that. That’s a, that’s a viable. It’s a viable thought. I really want to hear what you guys think. Yeah. I really want to know what your theories are. I know. And actually if, if, if a good don’t, if a good theory comes up, we’ll give you, we’ll give you a plug. Yeah. Plug, plug. But let’s talk about it.

You don’t need to leave a new episode for you. Yeah. You don’t need to leave a cu cuss us out. Yeah. You don’t need to leave a once her review and be like, you suck. Like, like, like let’s actually try to have an logical conversation about it and see maybe if we. Come to some sort of better conclusion. All right, guys. That’s what we got. Jfk. Yes. So, um, please hate us.

Hate us. Love us. I don’t know what to say. Those are our opinions. Just keep listening, just interact with us like we just wanna talk to you. Somebody talk to me, please. I’m so sick of these two assholes, . All right guys. Catch your next one. All. Thanks for hanging out guys. .